01:53:11 <prock> #startmeeting 01:53:11 <fifer`> Meeting started Wed Jan 6 01:53:11 2010 UTC. The chair is prock. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 01:53:11 <fifer`> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 01:53:21 <vtchill> the build worked and rio is running 01:53:34 <prock> you installed it also? 01:53:36 <vtchill> going to run the debug build as well 01:53:38 <vtchill> yep installed 01:53:44 <prock> nice 01:54:12 <prock> #topic remaining issues before 0.3.0 release 01:54:34 <prock> okay what do we have left? 01:55:00 <prock> documentation is just about done. I have to go over the release notes again and known issues. 01:55:15 <vtchill> i think we may need to consolidate some of the build targets and figure out exactly what should be a build target 01:55:23 <prock> #action prock will go over release notes again 01:55:24 <vtchill> and nice wiki page describing all the options is a must 01:55:40 <prock> right forgot about that 01:55:43 <prock> I can work on that tomorrow 01:56:13 <prock> #action prock will work on wiki page describing all the build targets 01:56:33 <vtchill> what to do for msvc on win32 01:56:57 <vtchill> how is it going to do the python install properly 01:57:24 <prock> not sure 01:57:34 <prock> okay lets talk about the build targets 01:57:44 <prock> get that out of the way 01:57:49 <prock> what exactly do you mean? 01:59:20 <vtchill> ok so when will install-all be used 02:00:02 <prock> when you want to install everything... static, shared, headers, and python library (along with extensions) 02:00:18 <prock> install-python = only python releated stuff 02:00:25 <prock> install-static = only static library 02:00:32 <prock> install-shared = only shared library 02:00:35 <prock> install-dev = headers 02:00:47 <vtchill> yep i understand, just was curious if it was something that would be used 02:01:02 <prock> maybe not... but someone might have the need 02:01:20 <prock> we dont have to document much other than install-python at this point 02:01:20 <vtchill> yea i guess as long as all the install targets are documented then all is well 02:01:37 <prock> as the static/shared objects aren't really meant to be used at this point 02:01:44 <vtchill> yea 02:02:15 <vtchill> ok that is good to go then 02:02:34 <prock> so you're okay with leaving them the way they are? 02:02:56 <prock> I guess if they cause some confusion they can easily be changed 02:02:58 <vtchill> yep i think they are fine 02:03:02 <prock> okay 02:03:14 <prock> #agreed build targets will remain as they are for 0.3.0 02:04:11 <prock> okay so next topic... the python install on msvc 02:04:41 <vtchill> one more thing, what should the build-python target do exactly 02:04:47 <vtchill> where does it put the output files 02:05:18 <prock> build/engine/debug/ I believe 02:05:57 <vtchill> ok so it doesn't copy it to the swigwrappers 02:06:27 <vtchill> so we no longer install anything to swigwrappers, i guess unless the user sets the destdir to it 02:06:43 <prock> actually.. the files still get copied there 02:06:53 <prock> so they exist in 2 places 02:07:03 <vtchill> thats probably not good 02:07:41 <prock> I can kill the copy of the .pyd file 02:08:03 <prock> the fife_wrap.h and .cc files get copied there as well 02:08:08 <prock> but they are needed for msvc 02:08:18 <vtchill> yea they are needed 02:08:40 <vtchill> win32 in general is a hard platform , i really don't know where stuff should be put 02:08:48 <prock> I'm not too worried 02:09:05 <prock> there are no standards in win32 for things like this so we can pretty much make up whatever we want 02:09:06 <prock> hehee 02:09:12 <prock> "keep it simple" 02:09:24 <vtchill> yea just worried about making it easy to use 02:09:52 <prock> yeah on windows if you are developing for FIFE you now have an extra step of installing the python libraries 02:10:00 <prock> actually.. I wrote an install batch file 02:10:05 <prock> but it runs scons 02:10:38 <vtchill> so we can run it as a post build process 02:10:41 <vtchill> for msvc 02:10:55 <prock> yes and no.. it would have to build the fife-python target 02:10:58 <prock> so it could install it 02:11:09 <vtchill> well msvc will build the python target 02:11:15 <vtchill> and then the batch script will run 02:12:03 <prock> the batch script that runs scons? 02:12:29 <prock> wait a sec.. in msvc how to you get the fife_wrap.cc and .h? 02:12:42 <prock> you have to do a complete build of python-fife for that dont you? 02:12:51 <vtchill> yep 02:13:10 <prock> is that always the way it is in trunk also? 02:13:41 <prock> just thought of something 02:13:55 <vtchill> well its a tough problem because the msvc stuff relies on the _wrap stuff to be there and the scripts used to build it always whenever scons was run 02:14:15 <vtchill> and we used to run scons to generate the project files as a prebuild event which created the _wrap functions 02:14:30 <vtchill> so it used to "work" as a result 02:14:34 <vtchill> now we don't do that 02:15:06 <prock> right so full build is required to get the first fife_wrap.h 02:15:11 <prock> thats no good 02:15:13 <vtchill> yep 02:15:15 <vtchill> its bad 02:15:34 <prock> I'll write a target so it will generate project files and wrap files at the same time 02:15:37 <prock> without having to build fife 02:15:49 <vtchill> seems like a hack solution 02:16:41 <prock> unless 02:16:53 <prock> we create a pre build step that just calls swig 02:16:58 <prock> the same way scons does 02:17:22 <prock> there would have to be a little playing around as the fife.i file needs to be generated 02:17:31 <prock> but that should easily be done in a python script 02:18:08 <vtchill> if msvc just called scons none of this would be an issue :) 02:18:30 <prock> so you're leaning toward that? 02:18:39 <vtchill> it has its own problems 02:18:49 <prock> hehe yeah... no autocomplete 02:19:09 <vtchill> i would say for now if a target to generate the _wrap files is easy we should do it that way and add it as a prebuild step 02:19:50 <prock> so call the target "swig"? 02:20:11 <vtchill> yea that should be fine 02:20:17 <prock> #agreed create a new target that will be called from msvc as a pre-build step 02:20:37 <prock> so if I add the target can you update the msvc templates? 02:20:42 <vtchill> did we want to make the swig call a builder anywa 02:20:58 <vtchill> yep i can update the msvc stuff 02:21:19 <prock> yes we wanted to make a builder for the fife.i file 02:21:27 <prock> but I haven't been able to figure that out 02:21:43 <vtchill> yea just figured that would make it easier to make it an install target 02:21:46 <prock> creating a target to run swig shouldn't be an issue though 02:21:49 <vtchill> oops meant build target 02:22:30 <prock> #action prock will make a new swig target for creating the fife_wrap files 02:23:20 <prock> #action vtchill will update the msvc project file templates with a pre-build step that calls the new scons swig target 02:24:02 <prock> okay so how does it get installed? 02:24:14 <prock> post build step to install... batch file? 02:24:47 <vtchill> yep it will have to be a post build step 02:24:52 <vtchill> for the python build 02:25:42 <prock> how good are you with batch files? 02:26:01 <vtchill> not bad, i can take care of the batch file and msvc stuff 02:26:17 <prock> I'm thinking maybe we should re-organize things a bit so it isn't required to be installed 02:26:29 <vtchill> what do you mean 02:26:31 <prock> all you have to do is set your python path 02:27:00 <prock> i.e. you would have a directory like: <fife>/python/fife 02:27:20 <prock> which will have the extensions in it: <fife>/python/fife/extensions 02:27:26 <prock> that way the imports aren't messed up 02:28:15 <vtchill> yea but the python stuff should be installed in the correct place by default unless the user supplies a dest dir 02:28:41 <prock> k so we'll leave that until after 02:29:19 <prock> #action vtchill will also take care of the msvc post build batch file that will copy the python objects to their correct places 02:29:44 <prock> but I guess... if I'm working on the extensions I have to install them every time I change one 02:29:51 <prock> kindof a pain 02:30:02 <prock> bah 02:30:06 <prock> we'll handle that after the release 02:30:18 <prock> not enough time to piss around with that yet 02:31:23 <vtchill> yea its a tough situation because if you think of it from a client perspective they aren't modifying fife code so they want it installed and done, we want something different we are changing so we want to modify and test easily 02:31:41 <prock> yup 02:31:52 <prock> which is why the easiest solution would be to re-organize a little bit 02:31:58 <prock> to have best of both worlds 02:32:15 <prock> from a client perspective the python objects all get installed correctly 02:32:27 <vtchill> what kind of reorganize are you talking about 02:32:36 <prock> from a developer point of view you dont have to install the python objects after every change 02:32:43 <prock> scroll up 02:33:05 <prock> move the python objects into something like this: 02:33:16 <prock> <fife>/engine/python/fife 02:33:23 <prock> <fife>/engine/python/fife/extensions 02:33:56 <vtchill> well we essentially have that with the swigwrappers/python/... 02:34:12 <prock> yes but the imports will no longer work after the update I did today 02:34:33 <prock> because it's assuming you have a <python>/site-packages/fife 02:34:35 <prock> directory 02:34:41 <prock> and the extensions are under that 02:34:55 <prock> so I would change the layout a bit 02:35:00 <vtchill> well if we just added a directory fife so swigwrappers/python/fife it would work right 02:35:18 <prock> nope... we would have to move the extensions under that 02:35:29 <vtchill> yea the extensions would need to be there as well 02:35:50 <prock> and the developer would have to add <fife>/engine/swigwrappers/python to their python path 02:36:22 <vtchill> yea certainly no good solution 02:36:38 <prock> well its easy for developers to add to their python path 02:36:48 <prock> if they understand thats what they have to do 02:37:26 <prock> so I think we should copy the fife.py and _fife.pyd files to: <fife>/engine/python/fife 02:37:42 <prock> and move the extensions to <fife>/engine/python/fife 02:38:01 <vtchill> don't know if i like a python directory under engine, i would rather it be under /build 02:38:22 <prock> well.. the swigwrappers have to go there 02:38:28 <prock> er 02:38:29 <prock> sorry 02:38:33 <prock> the extensions have to go there 02:38:47 <prock> we wouldn't copy them there as a build step.. it would be their permanent home 02:39:07 <vtchill> yea thats true 02:39:41 <vtchill> sounds good to me 02:39:52 <prock> so where do you want them? 02:40:11 <prock> we could put them <fife>/python/fife 02:40:12 <vtchill> you convinced me with the engine/python argument 02:40:32 <vtchill> i just worry b/c when i think of engine i think of only core stuff 02:40:40 <vtchill> but we have a engine/core so i guess its ok 02:40:46 <prock> yeah thats why we have core 02:40:52 <prock> okay I'll do that then 02:41:36 <prock> #action prock will move swigwrappers and fife.py and _fife.pyd to <fife>/engine/python/fife to make life a little easier for developers 02:41:42 <prock> okay anything else? 02:42:02 <vtchill> should we even start discussing the other build targets yet, or wait on those 02:42:49 <prock> static and shared? 02:42:59 <vtchill> oh yea i am also going to modify the msvc templates to create more build configurations to reflect all the configurations we have now 02:43:07 <prock> ahh sweet 02:43:16 <vtchill> meant to make that an action sorry forgot to put it there 02:43:47 <prock> #action vtchill will modify msvc templates to create more build configurations to reflect all configurations we have now 02:43:54 <vtchill> yea i was talking about static and shared up above 02:44:10 <prock> we'll discuss those for 0.3.1 maybe.. or even farther in the future 02:44:15 <prock> depending on how 0.3.1 goes 02:44:19 <vtchill> ok 02:44:27 <prock> cool man 02:44:30 <prock> thats all I can think of 02:44:38 <prock> we have this week 02:44:39 <prock> and thats it 02:44:45 <prock> we merge into trunk on monday 02:45:00 <vtchill> ok for the msvc i was th inking a build_debug_python, build_debug_shared, build_debug_static 02:45:03 <vtchill> and a release version for each 02:45:29 <prock> prefect 02:45:43 <prock> and the python ones will be the only ones needing the pre-build step 02:45:48 <prock> hope thats possible 02:46:10 <vtchill> one question was the build_python will call scons fife-python... but will then need to call the external script to actually do the install stuff of copying files 02:46:35 <vtchill> yep and the prebuilt step as well 02:47:53 <prock> the prebuild step will be: scons swig 02:48:54 <vtchill> yep 02:49:15 <prock> and the postbuild step will just be a batch file that copies the fife.py _fife.pyd and extensions to <python>/site-packages/fife 02:49:54 <vtchill> yea 02:51:01 <prock> and we can assume it's c:\python26\lib\site-packages.... 02:51:14 <prock> you can put a variable at the top of teh batch file 02:51:16 <vtchill> yea was just about to ask about the python version 02:51:27 <prock> all our other batch files assume c:\python26 02:51:32 <prock> so why change now 02:51:32 <vtchill> we really shouldn't assume but we do anyhow in the other batch files 02:51:32 <prock> hehehe 02:51:39 <vtchill> yea 02:51:56 <prock> if they put python somewhere else it's up to them to update the batch files 02:52:02 <prock> until we have a better solution 02:52:05 <vtchill> yea 02:52:06 <vtchill> sounds good 02:52:22 <prock> okay great 02:52:24 <prock> I have to go man 02:52:28 <prock> have a good night 02:52:30 <prock> see you tomorrow 02:52:33 <prock> #endmeeting